in Search
Welcome to Neopoleon - Sign in | Join | Help
Navigation: Home | Forums | Galleries

Christopher Anthony left some stupidity in my inbox

I don't really have time for this right now, but I can't help it.

I was recently contacted by someone named "Christopher Anthony." He's the same guy who started the totally out of place OSS vs. MS debate in my post that was meant to be:

1) A shout out to Ryan Rinaldi on his birthday

2) A mildly humorous commentary on sugar-free candies that make you poop more than you'd like

If starting a platform flamewar in that post isn't jumping in at the wrong time, then I don't know what is.

However, my friends, consider this: I spent Friday night in the company of people who have a strong interest in the OSS world. We hung out, ate with each other, and drank with each other for the better part of several hours. There was not one OSS vs. MS debate the entire time, and it isn't because we were just "being nice" to each other, but rather because we were all sane people who understand that you can be interested in OSS and MS at the same time <gasp!>.

The example I use to describe this situation is that I am:

1) Anti-abortion

2) Pro-choice

You absolutely can be both, and I am. The world isn't black and white - it's possible to have feelings about something which may appear to be in opposition with each other.

So, given that I am NOT (NOT! NOT! NOT!) anti-OSS, why am I getting emails with crap like this showing up in my inbox?

Its a commonly known fact that Open Source creates better software. Thats because we have an unlimited amount of people who can work on the project where Microsoft has what? 500 to 600 people who develop their software. Microsofts offerings are often times buggy and do erratic things.

Tearing something like this apart is, of course, like shooting fish in a barrel. I mean, c'mon, people! Don't waste my time with this stupid crap - think before you type (and, aren't there any OSS spell checkers this guy could've used?).

However, let's take this paragraph apart anyway:

1) "Its a commonly known fact that Open Source creates better software."

Is it? Is it really? Or is it simply a common opinion among some zealots? Do I really even need to talk about this? If I like the software that MS makes more than I like the software produced by the OSS community, then IT ISN'T A BLOODY-STINKING FACT, YOU RETARD.

2) "Thats because we have an unlimited amount of people who can work on the project"

Again, try to think. We live in a world of limited quantities of people. Most of those people are not software developers, and only a few of those people work on OSS. How did "a few" get turned into "unlimited?" Would anybody care to explain?

3) "...where Microsoft has what? 500 to 600 people who develop their software."

OK - all software developers out there with more than three weeks of experience, please step forward.

Since when did software projects become better by throwing more people at the task? In my experience, this is more often a recipe for doom than it is success.

And where in the hell did that "500 to 600 people" stat come from?

Do you see why this pisses me off? It's because this guy wants to argue with me, wants to spout stats, and he hasn't even done the tiniest bit of homework first. It's incredible. It's people like this who give OSS a very bad name.

4) "Microsofts offerings are often times buggy and do erratic things."

I love this one.

About half of all XFree86 installs I've ever used have thoroughly crapped their pants at some point in time. Sometimes to the point that I'm left scratching my head and thinking that I'm going to have to rebuild the system (which has happened).

But, I guess that doesn't count as "buggy" or "erratic" in this guy's book.

I'm also willing to bet that he'd argue that, because it's never happened to him, that it's never happened to anybody.

So, that's all I'm going to take apart here. The scary thing is that this is only one paragraph out of many, most of which were equally stupid.

This is one reason why I lost a lot of interest in OSS. They want so badly for everybody to be using their software, but then they drive you away buy spouting crap arguments and stopping just short of calling you evil and stupid for using MS products. If you want me to use your software, then don't insult my intelligence by trying to argue that the software I use is bad because you think the company that produces it is evil.

Congratulations, Christopher Anthony: You've just won the first ever Neopoleon.com "Shove it up your ass" award. You can come collect in New London, Connecticut, although you're going to have to bring your own lube.

Published Monday, March 15, 2004 8:44 PM by Rory

Filed Under:

Comments

 

Henry Erich said:

<i>About half of all XFree86 installs I've ever used have thoroughly crapped their pants at some point in time. Sometimes to the point that I'm left scratching my head and thinking that I'm going to have to rebuild the system (which has happened).</i>

This reminds me of something I heard (once) but apologetically have not had time to test.
I heard from a trusted source that the Lindows (or Lin-dash) OS takes about 15 minutes to start up and many hours to install.
Rory, have you tried Lindows?
March 15, 2004 8:54 PM
 

Josh Baltzell said:

Although I understand the meaning of the language I can't define the phrase "Shove it up your ass". It is a lot like the phrase "I got your <noun /> right here." *2 handed self pelvis pointing*.

With both of these phrases I can understand what the person using the phrase means, but I just don't understand the instructions. Are you instructing him to shove his email up his ass or just any object that would cause discomfort? Wait... don't answer that.

I have to agree though based on what you posted that Ryan is at least a candidate for an award like this. I better go read his blog first before I make and final decisions about whether or not he is an official asshat. No publicity is bad publicity huh? :)
March 15, 2004 9:11 PM
 

Josh Baltzell said:

Wait, I can't read. I meant Christopher Anthony not Ryan.

Never trust a man with two first names.
March 15, 2004 9:13 PM
 

Andy said:

Heh. I hate getting stuff like that in my e-mail too. I used to be a hard core OSS junky but you know what? Unless you are an egghead most OSS stuff is not user friendly. I like OSS; I like MS. MS makes me money OSS does not. Why? The people who run OSS stuff do not need me they are by and large developers or engineers or some other form of tech nerd like myself. General everyman users are so turned off by OSS products most won't use it unless it's forced on them. I would say this to all OSS zealots, if you want me to switch to developing and using only or mainly OSS products then give my end users a better alternative that makes them want to jump to OSS. I don't mean almost as good as or any halfway cr@p either give me better from start to finish on one product that MS sells and I'll switch to that product. Don't expect me to switch for any semantic reason like "OSS is morally....blah...blah...blah...blah" give me real-time full life cycle better. Better to install, better to maintain, better to upgrade, better to update, better to network, and the list goes on. Apple did it with their iPod. They came out with a genuine better alternative to MS's product. So I use Apple's iPod. OSS has never so far given me a better alternative for anything. Cheaper yes, better no. This is coming from a person that has run Linux as a desktop since before people thought you could do that. I run lots of OSS stuff including an open source OS at home because it's cheaper. I develop at home for both but my money maker is MS. Again why? Because it's what the users like, the market does not give two sh!ts about whether it's cheap or not to buy. If the users don't like it, it will end up being more expensive in the long run. Period, end of story. Give the users something they like, is easy to use, and intuitive. In short give them a reason to switch. They are happy with MS. All the semantic bullsh!t in the world isn’t going to convince one user to switch. You have to give them something better that makes them want to switch. OSS zealots say OSS produces better software, better how? It isn’t better if users don't want it, no matter how much it gets the geeks off. Prove me wrong Apple did, and I now write software for Apple too. Until then I will continue to play with my OSS stuff at home but money drives my development and users drive my money. Convince them.
March 15, 2004 9:24 PM
 

NJ John said:

As the kids say: _pwnd_

Nice job, Rory.
March 15, 2004 9:45 PM
 

Gee said:

Ah, Rory...the more I read, the more I love you.
g
March 15, 2004 10:08 PM
 

Sven Groot said:

Yes, everyone who ever dares to suggest that MS is anything less than satan reincarnated will have to deal with such people at some point. Especially at university (Computer Science department), it sometimes seems that everybody is a Linux freak (although the latest batch seems to be a bit more open-minded, there's hope yet).

I actually know a guy, who really is the king nerd among nerds. A guy so nerdy, that most other nerds won't talk to him. A guy who doesn't even know his Windows password, because he always uses Linux on the faculty PCs. A guy who if a programming assignment comes with a predeveloped MFC app where you just have to fill in the blanks will develop a similar application using Gtk at 20x the work.

Two years back, I had a course called "Human Computer Interaction", or "Interfaces" for short. He said to me at one time, during that course, that he shouldn't care to develop a good user interface, since if users want to use *his* program, they'll have to learn *his* command interface, and if they're too stupid for that they have no business using his software. Yeah, that'll make it real big in the Real World(tm)!!

And the irony of it all is, he owns a PowerBook.
March 15, 2004 10:12 PM
 

Joel Spolsky said:

Welcome to my life.

Oh, except that I don't live in New London, CT.

Or have toilet paper tubes in my eyes
March 15, 2004 10:45 PM
 

Jason Olson said:

Well Played. Good Form! I love it!

Just make sure that after the lube, you don't "fall" on one of those New London smoke stacks, eh?
March 16, 2004 12:18 AM
 

Scott said:

Please don't feed the trolls. They're like eczema, if you keep scratching them they'll never get better.
March 16, 2004 12:20 AM
 

Joe Grenier said:

Speaking of open source software, I would like to know how Rory feels about his beloved Sugar industry trying to destroy the Alternative Sweetener market. Your unfounded accusations against Splenda in your post the other day offer more proof that you're just another mindless shill of "Big Sugar". It's an undisputed fact that sugar free foods are simply better than those laden with that sticky middle class crack you seem so fond of. Look pal, a little diahrhea is a small price to pay for a truly free society (and I mean "free" as in "sugar free" not "free beer").
March 16, 2004 12:54 AM
 

TomB said:

When is Joe getting his own blog. He kills me.

No offence Rory...you kill me too.
March 16, 2004 4:12 AM
 

vbNullString said:

hahaha way to go Rory!
If Bill Gates is a seal clubbing bastard, why is he still playing the major role at Microsoft while he can just collect his money and go retire? I love how Microsoft innovates software. I went to DevDays today, and I am excited about what we are going to be able to do and how productive we are going to be!
March 16, 2004 5:33 AM
 

Ian said:

Laughing my arse off right now!!

I read a quote from a Netscape guy once who said they knew they'd lost the browser war when they found out that Microsoft had 50 times the number of developers working on IE.

Did you know that 76.5% of all statistics are made up?


March 16, 2004 7:44 AM
 

Dominic Cronin said:

I just love the way you throw in the abortion thing too, Rory. It'll be a close run thing as to whether your house gets torched by abortionists or geek-wannabees.
March 16, 2004 8:14 AM
 

Paul Bartlett said:

Personally I'm with Eric Lippert when it comes to all of these techie "religious wars":

http://blogs.geekdojo.net/pdbartlett/archive/2004/03/01/1259.aspx
March 16, 2004 8:48 AM
 

Paul Murphy said:

Interesting points. Not only did your friend not do research on MS, they didn't do research on Linux. The numbers (public) show less than 600 developers contributed to the Linux kernel in the last year, which is less than unlimited. But in reality, it doesn't matter how many (as you pointed out), it's about the process and more importantly the resulting technology.

I posted on an easy fix for this debate last week -

"If it sucks, don’t use it and don’t develop on it. That will motivate that platform, vendor, initiative, consortium, whatever to either improve it or drop it. That’s a good thing."

http://paul.bz/blog/posts/370.aspx
March 16, 2004 9:24 AM
 

Chris Hynes said:

Definately agreed. This kind of unfounded statements and acusations are what are pushing me away from OSS. I'm still at a kind of pragmatic use what works position, but I things like this make me root for Microsoft. At least MS has acts professionally. Open Source zealots like this reflect badly on those who are actually promoting OSS because it's better for a specific solution. Who's going to listen if most "Open Source" guys are spouting off crap?

I recently wrote a post on this topic on my blog as well: http://krystalware.com/blog/archive/2004/02/20/189.aspx
March 16, 2004 1:33 PM
 

Josh Pollard said:

I'm with you Rory. I've been using MS basically since I started using computers, but lately I have gotten into the OSS side of things and I do enjoy it. For example, I'm really interested in the mono project. I love the idea of running .NET apps on Linux! Everyone just needs to calm down and pull their heads out of their butts. Oh, and due to your comment on abortion I'm sure we can expect to see some hate messages in the next google weirdos!
March 16, 2004 1:37 PM
 

M Kenyon said:

MS Zealots, please don't hurt me! I use Sharp Develop!


But I use VS at work... I just don't have the money to get XP Pro and VS at home. But Sharp Develop works on Win98. I only do small stuff at home... but it works.

Does that make me bad?
March 16, 2004 2:09 PM
 

Chis A. said:

Linux has taken alot of business away from Microsoft, look at Munich and EDS which was primarily a Windows development house is even jumping ship and going with Linux. While I respect Carl and Rory as VS.NET developers, we need them, I must say that all serious development work now is being done on Linux. You dont see any high performance computing solutions run on Windows and .NET, they run Linux and Java. Look at NASA, they run Altix with Linux and Maestro is a Java application. You dont see Windows on clusters because A, it would be more costly to do so and B, the reliability of Windows is not there. As Eric Raymond would say, Would you buy a car with the hood welded shut? I doubt it. With Linux we have unlimited programmers who can actually fix the problems and can recompile the work and distribute it. With the Shared Source initiative you cant even recompile it much less distribute and if you work on Windows source code you are considered tainted by Open Source standards and good luck trying to get any project to take code from you for fear of liability. The shared source initiative turns developers into a risk. With Linux I can turn anything from a 486 to a 166 into a Web server, with Windows you do not have that option. As I stated to Rory, Open Source does not put a strangle hold on anyone. You can use any Open Source package with any version of Linux, IE will not be developed for the older versions anymore and they cut Mac and UNIX support and Office 2003 does not even work on Windows 9x/NT4/ME. With as many consumers still using those operating systems they have been literally abandoned by Microsoft. I can understand Carl and Rory, no disrespect intended but once you get the Microsoft mindset so thourougly instilled its hard for them to see the truth much less see it, but as I stated I say that with the upmost respect and I still listen to .NET rocks and the show is a great resource and I wish more MONO developers would listen to the show because it would give them more of a understanding of being able to cooperate with the .NET framework because until the SEC finishes its current investigation into Microsofts illegal activities in regards to SCO MS will pretty much stay the dominant player and its very important to be able to coexist. For my limited Windows programming I use SharpDevelop, mind you I am not a professional but more of a hobbyist but I have made public contributions. The GPL and Open Source based offerings are the future and in two short years anyone that does not develop for Linux will be left out in the cold. MonoDevelop and SharpDevelop are the key to interoperability and crossplatform functionality which is very important. Since MS does not develop an Open Source product for development we will have to rely on Open Standards if we dont then when Sun and IBM develop their Open Source Java offerings, C# will die. Linux is now the mainstream OS for serious computing and with thousands of migrations taking place everyday, the future is inevitable.
March 16, 2004 3:36 PM
 

Rory said:

Kenyon -

"MS Zealots, please don't hurt me! I use Sharp Develop!

...

Does that make me bad?"

It makes you *sane* :)

When VS.NET makes sense, *use* it. When SharpDevelop makes sens, *use* it :)
March 16, 2004 4:28 PM
 

Rory said:

Chris -

You aren't making much sense (a bit of rambling in there), but let's just address a couple issues:

1) "all serious development work now is being done on Linux"

I do development for my customers using .NET, and they consider it to be pretty serious.

Maybe that's why I'm usually employed.

2) "You dont see Windows on clusters"

Actually, *you* don't - I *do*.

3) "With Linux I can turn anything from a 486 to a 166 into a Web server"

Of course. And you can serve your three static pages to up to *two* simultaneous users!

Where do people even *find* 486's now?

Also, there was never a 486 166, but that's just a minor detail.

4) "IE will not be developed for the older versions anymore and they cut Mac and UNIX support"

You jack-ass. The reason they cut Mac and *nix support was the realization that those areas were well taken care of. I use Safari on my Mac, and, for *most* things, it beats the hell out of IE for OS X. It isn't the most *compatible* browser in the universe, but what it does well, it does *very* well.

Why should MS focus on competing with that?

5) "I can understand Carl and Rory"

No, you actually can't. Everything you've said demonstrates that you don't even remotely understand us.

6) "but once you get the Microsoft mindset so thourougly instilled its hard for them to see the truth much less see it"

You know what? You're winning this for one simple reason: You're pissing me off with your limitless stupidity, and I'm close to losing my cool.

I USE OSS SOFTWARE! YES! MY FAVORITE WEB BROWSER IN THE WORLD IS BUILT ON KHTML! TRUE! I DO NOT, REPEAT, DO *NOT* HATE OSS! I F*CKING USE IT, YOU BLIND ZEALOT BASTARD! CAN'T YOU SEE HOW *I* AM THE ONE HERE WITH THE OPEN MIND? I USE OSS! I USE OSS! I USE OSS! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY IT?

You talk smack about Microsoft, but you don't know anything about it. You spout bullshit statistics, and make claims which don't just indicate how ignorant you are in the MS world, but how *generally* ignorant you are. I hate to attack you instead of your arguments, but your arguments don't have any substance, and all I'm left with is the chump behind them.

7) "mind you I am not a professional but more of a hobbyist"

Oh, *really*. See, except for the fact that you don't know what you're talking about, it's really hard to tell that you're a hobbyist.

8) "in two short years anyone that does not develop for Linux will be left out in the cold"

We definitely are dealing with religion here.

Cults are always making predictions about the coming of The End of the world.

9) "if we dont then when Sun and IBM develop their Open Source Java offerings, C# will die."

Dude. You are such a jack-ass.

Open sourcing something does *not* ensure its success. What share of the desktop market does Linux have? Linux is OSS, and it definitely hasn't trounced Windows, and Linux has been around for a *long* time now.

Jesus. I can't believe I'm putting this much time into this.
March 16, 2004 4:45 PM
 

vbNullString said:

Oh my God, Chris Anthony is really an old fashioned Open Source guy. When I was reading his comment here, I felt I was looking at fossilized dinosaur. He has a very one sided way of looking at this industry. He doesn't know enough about Microsoft platform.
March 16, 2004 5:39 PM
 

Rob Windsor said:


Hey Chris,

I hope that in two short years everyone will figure out that hating each other helps no one and that we can all go out for a beer together and discuss how cool our favorite implementation of the CLI is.
March 16, 2004 5:42 PM
 

Jason Mauss said:

hey Chris A. dood, you ever heard of these things called paragraphs and sentences? Try using them.

Oh, woops, sorry nevermind I guess you wouldn't be a 1337 Linux c0d3r if u exhibited any writing skills.
March 16, 2004 5:42 PM
 

Chris A. said:

Actually I meant a 166mhz machine, two different computers, 486 and a 166hz.

" Open sourcing something does *not* ensure its success. What share of the desktop market does Linux have? Linux is OSS, and it definitely hasn't trounced Windows, and Linux has been around for a *long* time now. "

Open Source does ensure success because everyone can see it, no one is left out. If you wish to view the code, modify or distribute you are free to do so. In most cases the software is free. Linux is making so many inroads into Microsoft Windows territory that it isnt funny. I noticed you totally disregarded my mention of Munich and EDS, two major coups, Munich and EDS no longer have to deal with expensive software they have access to source code and viruses are non-existant and they can use older hardware and they dont have to worry about being left out in the cold should the community enhance their software.

" We definitely are dealing with religion here.

Cults are always making predictions about the coming of The End of the world. "

This is not religon but fact. By 2006 IDC predicts that Linux desktop marketshare will reach double digits. Linux has been around for 13 yrs but it was developed from scratch and enhanced by millions of volunteers and major technology industry players. Windows built on a product that was already there, in this case OS/2.

" I USE OSS SOFTWARE! YES! MY FAVORITE WEB BROWSER IN THE WORLD IS BUILT ON KHTML! TRUE! I DO NOT, REPEAT, DO *NOT* HATE OSS! I F*CKING USE IT, YOU BLIND ZEALOT BASTARD! CAN'T YOU SEE HOW *I* AM THE ONE HERE WITH THE OPEN MIND? I USE OSS! I USE OSS! I USE OSS! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY IT? "

No one said you hated OSS.

" You jack-ass. The reason they cut Mac and *nix support was the realization that those areas were well taken care of. I use Safari on my Mac, and, for *most* things, it beats the hell out of IE for OS X. It isn't the most *compatible* browser in the universe, but what it does well, it does *very* well. "

No, they cut development because they figured once they established dominance that they expected people to make the move over to Windows. That backfired and now they are sweating. Look at that biased "Get the Facts "
site full of Microsoft FUNDED studies. They figure they cant compete with quality so now they compete with FUD. Mozilla beats IE, FireFox beats IE and Evolution beats the heck out of Outlook and Outlook Express.

" Actually, *you* don't - I *do*. "

Oh yeah? Where? Find me one company or university that deploys at least a 64 CPU cluster driven by Windows. Find me an 128 CPU based machine that runs Windows Server. There are none.

" I do development for my customers using .NET, and they consider it to be pretty serious. "

Everything that I read on Newsforge and Slashdot show Java ahead of the race here. As I said, show me a serious development house that uses .NET, show me where .NET has made it into outer space. Linux is on Mars as is Java.

Also my final addition to our "discussion"

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1548325,00.asp

That is from eWeek, it deals with Microsofts stolen source code and security issues.

After you read it you will see how flawed closed source development is. With Open Source development we do not have to worry about the bad guy sitting on Flaws, what the bad guys see we see and we fix it within hours. We dont have to worry about being hacked by the same vulnerability time after time. You do. If Microsoft was to Open Source at least the kernel of Windows the Open Source community could iron out the bugs and have it fixed within 30 days, when you have an unlimited amount of people pouring over code this tends to happen and it might surprise you guys.

Second, http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1548324,00.asp Many of the people interviewed here believe Windows is less secure now than it was in the past. These are the facts and they are not disputed, more importantly these people are inevitably making the switch to Linux. They wont touch .NET but they will embrace the new Open Source version of Java once it is released. While these migrations may mean nothing to you guess what all it take is time and we will no longer be captive to Redmond. We will have an ecosystem with Open protocols and open standards and companies will be able to compete again without having to bow to Microsoft. .NET developers can either embrace the future or be stuck in their legacy models.
March 16, 2004 8:26 PM
 

NJ John said:

Wow, Chris has conviced me. I'm abandoning my paying job as a .NET developer, making elegent object-oriented applications with a beautiful framework in a fantastic IDE. Just because it's from <eeevil music>MICROSOFT!</eeevil music>

.
.
.

Just kidding.

Seriously, where does this guy get off? ".NET developers can either embrace the future or be stuck in their legacy models." WTF?

Sure, back around 1996/1997 Microsoft stuff sux0rd the big one. So I did Java. (I *still* like Java, I love Eclipse, Linux is aiight, so I'm not anti-anything.)

Fast forward to NOW -- .NET is HERE, big time. And it is a big part of the future as well. It is not going anywhere. .NET is currently the nicest platform around, and it just keeps getting better and more powerful. Every day I learn something new about .NET that makes me say: "sweeeet!".

I wonder if Chris A. has ever swallowed his zealotry long enough to sit down in front of VS.Net and crank out a C# application. Or an ASP.Net web service. Or ANYTHING .NET for that matter.
March 16, 2004 10:00 PM
 

Jason Mauss said:

Rory - I realize this is primary an argument between you and Chris, so please pardon my interruption here.

Chris your arguments are laughable. Seriously. Have you ever considered taking a few minutes to get your facts straight before shooting off your loose cannon mouth?

You said, "I noticed you totally disregarded my mention of Munich and EDS, two major coups, Munich and EDS no longer have to deal with expensive software"

How do you define "expensive" Chris? Just because they didn't pay $$ for the software doesn't mean it didn't cost them anything. Why don't you read a couple of links I spent 2 minutes digging up for you:
1. http://linuxquestions.org/questions/history/151159
2. http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/34891.html

Hmm, that doesn't sound like much of a "win" for Linux or OSS as you might like people to think.

You said, "This is not religon but fact. By 2006 IDC predicts..."

Whoa...since when did IDC predictions = fact? sorry pal...try again. Take off that OSS zealot hat first too, mmkay?

You said, "Find me one company or university that deploys at least a 64 CPU cluster driven by Windows. Find me an 128 CPU based machine that runs Windows Server. There are none."

Really? These people must be liars then eh? Why don't you have a look at this PowerPoint that shows a 64 CPU cluster driven by ...wait for it.... NT!
1. http://www.csm.ornl.gov/JPC4/NCSA-jpc4.ppt

You said, "Everything that I read on Newsforge and Slashdot show Java ahead of the race here..."

You are one serious n00b if you just blindly believe stuff you read about .NET ...especially from Slashdot. How much time have you spent developing with .NET? Be honest here. How much time?

You said, "As I said, show me a serious development house that uses .NET"

Uhmmmm, Microsoft? You have got to be on some serious drugs if you think there aren't any serious development shops using .NET already.

You said, "show me where .NET has made it into outer space. Linux is on Mars as is Java."

ok sorry I'm laughing my ass off too hard to be able to continue now....OMG man you could be a serious source of comic relief for developers if you only realized your potential.
March 17, 2004 12:23 AM
 

Ryan Dawson said:

Will everyone please stop responding to this guy until he at least gives proper identification (Chris A. -that's pretty damn unique). The link from his name points to kernel.org, and this guy is no way related to that organization.

Please stop responding. Anyone who responds is preaching to the choir.
March 17, 2004 12:43 AM
 

Roberto J. Dohnert said:

" You said, "show me where .NET has made it into outer space. Linux is on Mars as is Java." "

LOL, I hope he meant that as a joke because it is too funny. Just the way it was "said" made me bust a gut. His arguments were flawed. One thing about zealots, no matter how much you trash their so called "facts" the more they come back for more. He must be a pimple faced, undersexed, porn addict who needs some attention.
March 17, 2004 1:28 AM
 

Joe Grenier said:

Roberto,

Actually, *I'm* a pimple faced, undersexed, porn addict who needs some attention, but you don't see me engaging in mindless zealotry ;)
(ok, so I don't have any pimples...)
March 17, 2004 2:11 AM
 

NJ John said:

OK, OK - I've figured it out: This Chris A. guy is really Carl Franklin, trying to make Rory pop his nut. :-D
March 17, 2004 2:25 AM
 

Rory said:

NJ John -

"This Chris A. guy is really Carl Franklin, trying to make Rory pop his nut"

Consider it popped.

This Chris guy has really pissed me off. Not because he won't quit, but because he's *so* f'ing stupid.

I can handle arguments if they follow some sort of reasonable path, but this has just been all over the place.

Yup. Popped my nut has been.
March 17, 2004 2:32 AM
 

Roberto J. Dohnert said:

Welcome to my world Rory. When I switched from Linux to Windows XP and 2003 I was called a traitor, laughed at and supposed friends purposely sent me viruses in my e-mail. I was trashed on the web and off. I deal with people like "Chris A" everyday. If anyone has a reason to hate Linux zealots I do. Like you went through with Java for me it was a real wake up call.
March 17, 2004 2:48 AM
 

Roberto J. Dohnert said:

I dont "hate" Linux zealots by the way. I still get along with some of them and we have some good times together.
March 17, 2004 3:37 AM
 

Mark Anthony Spiteri said:

"Linux is now the mainstream OS for serious computing and with thousands of migrations taking place everyday, the future is inevitable."

Maybe I am living in another world. However at my University (I am a final year student reading a degree in Computer Science) two of my professors have switched to .NET after being hardcore Linux geeks. They would even diss MS during Lectures and expected that all assignments are done in C on Linux / Unix.

However nowadays they absolutely love .NET and use the .NET framework in their couse material.

Maybe we are all idiots - who knows...
March 17, 2004 6:34 AM
 

Mark Anthony Spiteri said:

"I must say that all serious development work now is being done on Linux"

I am currently writing a collobartion tool for my final year project in .NET so does that mean i am not serious about my degree?
March 17, 2004 6:38 AM
 

Chris A. said:

Rory-

I wasnt intending to piss you off, I was trying to show you how flawed MS was, but as I said the Microsoft mindset is so deeply instilled in you that I doubt you will change. When Microsofts marketshare is like the Macs, 1.8 % then maybe you will see the light until then I am not arguing with you about what you think and what I know. You claim I didnt stick to good examples. I think it was the other way around, everything I brought up showing how MS was a bad company and how their products sucked you totally ignored those in your rants. If you and Carl would come back to the side of the good guys then I would have even higher respect for you. I will continue to listen to the show to improve mono.

Jason Mauss -

Thank you for those links to actual articles. But as I said in my posts. .NET is secondary. You showed me 1 64 CPU cluster with Windows NT, I can show you thousands of Linux clusters that scale up from 64 to thousands of clusters. Munich and EDS are bound to run into problems because they were so totally strangled by MS in the past they are having a hard time changing over. But they will change and they will be huge success stories. Linux is cheaper, better and more secure with less vulnerabilities and an unlimited number of programmers contributing to it.

Roberto J. Dohnert -

I followed your link to your homepage and to your Linux Icebox site, I must say very pathetic posting it on Geocities. You have what? maybe 2 visitors per year to your site.
You used to support Linux and I liked your position paper on SCO and I agreed with most of what you said. I must say since you switched sides you have almost become a flaming Windows zealot. You are a traitor and if I had known about what you did I would have gone as far as discredit you as well. Windows has not improved that much to make anyone switch and now you are filling the wallets of people that you used to hate and now you are supporting SCO as well. You are as pathetic and immoral as MS now.

This will be my last post to this blog because you people cannot have a decent conversation. I asked Rory a reasonable question and now I am being attacked with no excuse whatsover. If anyone wishes to continue this debate feel free to e-mail me. I have included the address. But before i go I will say this. When the SEC closes down Microsoft for supporting SCO and you guys are stuck on the legacy systems. I will come back and post in huge font, I TOLD YOU SO.
March 17, 2004 4:38 PM
 

marco said:

"1) Anti-abortion

2) Pro-choice"


very elegantly done!

March 17, 2004 5:54 PM
 

Joel Semeniuk said:

We should just ask Dr. Phil - he'll know what is best.
March 17, 2004 6:06 PM
 

Anonymous said:

Chris A.,

I know that Rory has done the smart thing and started ignoring your almost incomprehensible rants, but I had to make one comment about your last statement (you see, I am not quite as smart as the owner of this blog):

"When the SEC closes down Microsoft for supporting SCO and you guys are stuck on the legacy systems. I will come back and post in huge font, I TOLD YOU SO."

Tell, me Chris, if in two years time, all of your grandiose predictions have NOT come to pass, will you come back and post in equally huge font: "I was completely wrong. I am terribly sorry for being judgemental, arrogant and rude. I never should have claimed to have wanted a reasonable discussion when I was engaging in vast hyperbole, unsubstantiated statements and personal attacks."

Well Chris, will ya?

March 17, 2004 7:58 PM
 

Joe Grenier said:

The last comment was mine. Forgot to sign it.
March 17, 2004 8:00 PM
 

Roberto J. Dohnert said:

Chris A, I am not going to cuss you out on Rory's blog. Instead, I am going to ignore your last post and personal attack on me. I was a Linux zealot for a long time and I hope and I pray that if I was at least half of the jackass you are that people will forgive me. I went to Windows specifically to learn .NET because unlike what you think my customers were requesting it. I lost a lot of potential clients because I was totally against Windows programming. I learned my lesson and while I may be a practical rookie when it comes to .NET at least I am learning it, and I learn something everyday. My Java guys have really stuck with .NET and I dont have to turn potential business away because I dont have a crew thats fluent in C# and Visual Basic. I went to learn and I stayed with Windows. Not to support SCO, not to feed the wallet of Bill Gates but because of all my zealotry I was wrong about Windows. Windows and .NET and especially C# are great tools with which to get a job done and I have really come to appreciate the quality of Windows. I can get the software I want and not have to settle for anything thats just good enough. I dont have to pray that whatever hardware I bought works with Linux. Oh and congrats, you were part of 150 visitors this week on my website. I use Geocities because i dont have time to maintain a web server, I do work. Maybe one day I will set up a web server and I will use either Windows Server 2003 or maybe Solaris, perhaps even Linux it depends on my mood that day. I really hope you do not come back here because we have better things to do with our time than to respond to rants and attacks.
March 18, 2004 12:47 AM
 

Anonymous said:

June 13, 2004 8:41 PM
 

David Totzke said:

Anybody else find it ironic that Chris A's email address is from "Yahoo"?

(synonymous with crazy in my part of the globe)
June 14, 2004 4:58 AM
 

Christian Romney said:

I love when people come up with their own standards to prove a point. Take the 64 processor cluster. What the hell is the point of that? Guess he never considered we may not need 64 processors. In fact, I'd be more proud of NOT finding a single 64 processor machine! Talk about Total Cost of Ownership. So the OS comes free, but you're going to need to purchase a 64 processor machine for a couple of hundred thousand dollars. Yes, now I see how that's better than paying $1500 for a Windows Server license and needing only a 4 or 8 processor machine. There's a reason benchmarks agree on the work being done and try to setup comparable systems. The analogy is ridiculous. As for being in space, who gives a shit? Linux can have Mars, I'm not likely to be doing any development up there any time soon. And how does that fact that the Rover people chose Java/Linux translate into anything that would sway me one way or another in making a platform choice here on Earth? Lastly, this unlimited developer stuff is pure garbage for about a thousand reasons, but let's pick only a couple. 1. More != better. You can have 1000 times more people working on something, but if they're all inferior to the 5 or 6 I've got working on something else my product will be better. 2. In fact, most open source projects have a handful of people working on them. And sure, some dude might tinker around for a few days but in the long term it's a few committed people who have done most of the significant work. 3. Check out the Mythical Man Month. Brook's Law. 4. Aww, why bother...
June 14, 2004 2:56 PM
 

Anonymous said:

June 14, 2004 3:58 PM
 

Anonymous said:

June 14, 2004 6:43 PM
 

dda said:

8) "in two short years anyone that does not develop for Linux will be left out in the cold"

We definitely are dealing with religion here.

===============================================

Short years vs long years? When's the next leap year? :-)

In preparation of doom's day, I shall move to the tropics, Singapore, or Bali, somewhere warm that'll protect me and my family from stern weather forecasts.
June 15, 2004 5:46 AM
 

Jeremy said:

Wow. What a find! <bookmarked> And I'm gonna see if there's an RSS feed anywhere.

Chris lost it with me with this one, tiny statement:

"Everything that I read on Newsforge and Slashdot show Java ahead of the race here. As I said, show me a serious development house that uses .NET, show me where .NET has made it into outer space. Linux is on Mars as is Java."

This is like saying MoveOn.org shows Kerry (or Nader) to be ahead in the polls by 80%. Can you honestly tell me that "news" from an extremely biased news source is "news"? Please.
June 15, 2004 5:40 PM
 

Alex said:

Just a remark... Roberto, you do not have the time to install a web server but you do have time to post lots here and in other places I guess.

I can understand the poor linux zealot he has nothing better to do but you?

Anyway funny reading it reminded me again people are so different. Which is good.
June 28, 2004 9:48 PM
 

Belzebub said:

-----------------
4) "Microsofts offerings are often times buggy and do erratic things."

I love this one.

About half of all XFree86 installs I've ever used have thoroughly crapped their pants at some point in time. Sometimes to the point that I'm left scratching my head and thinking that I'm going to have to rebuild the system (which has happened).
----------------------


Yea Rory,

you are soo insighful. Give me one single time when your Xfree86 freezing up actually destroyed all your documents in every single folder, or corrupted your operating system, and sent all your data out to the internet via the latest virus you just caught on your xterm ?

you moron, of course MS is kak !.

MS is kak, cause it is built by underpaid programmers, and their releases are based on deadlines set by managers who have no fucking clue what a browser is.
MS programmers are also made to believe they are a "family", when in fact they are just being sodomized by the Idiots In Charge who pay themselves the lowest wages ever (offsetting them with nice stock options), just so that you as a programmer are paid basically the same as the beggar on State Street.

That makes them very motivated, and able to write nice software !.

I am not a Zealot, and I can even call some of the MS software/ideas written in the past very good, as for example, the Start button. But it is all kak in essence, cause every single piece of software is all linked to all else on your box, and if you upgrade to the latest security patches, then "ohhhh, woooowww, my programs dont work anymore, I have to spend another 5000 to upgrade them"

Fuck off man, you make me puke.

You dont even understand what open source is.
July 2, 2004 2:38 PM
 

Rory said:

Belzebub -

"MS is kak, cause it is built by underpaid programmers, and their releases are based on deadlines set by managers who have no fucking clue what a browser is."

How much do MS coders make?

Don't know, do you? Plus, who determined what "underpaid" is? If you love what you do, then you might be willing to take a little less for doing it.

Anyway, it's probably more than the people sitting in their basements, contributing to OSS for free.

"who pay themselves the lowest wages ever (offsetting them with nice stock options)"

MS no longer "offsets" wages with stock options - MS determined that their stock wasn't performing well enough to be a worthwhile form of compensation. Now, MS offers higher than average market wages combined with great benefits and good bonuses.

"That makes them very motivated, and able to write nice software"

They actually *do* write great software. It's why the OSS communities are always playing catch-up.

"I am not a Zealot"

I know. You're a good, old-fashioned moron.

"But it is all kak in essence, cause every single piece of software is all linked to all else on your box, and if you upgrade to the latest security patches, then 'ohhhh, woooowww, my programs dont work anymore, I have to spend another 5000 to upgrade them'"

Interesting thought. I've never had to pay $5,000 to repair damage done by a security patch. Sounds like somebody may have taken advantage of you (which is a huge surprise given your obviously superior intellect).

Anyway, this is another yawner. I don't know why I bother with "people" like you anymore. It's the same bullshit over and over.
July 2, 2004 7:36 PM
 

Belzebub said:

HAHHAHAHAHHAA

you make me laugh dude.

I don't even need superior intellect to realize that idiots like you keep MS alive out of some uncanny love and awe for the idiot in charge (gates).

I tell you an anectoda (true story):
Gates was at a coffee shop in Seattle, and the attendant was missing 25 cents change. Gates stood there at the cash register for 10 minutes fighting for that 25 cents, until one of the dudes in the now large line of people that had formed behind him, came over and told Gates to piss off, and chipped in his missing 25 cents.

Now, we can understand how can people with the COMPLETE LACK OF REGARD FOR OTHERS' WELL BEING can build crap like the MS operating system.


I actually feel rather good that there are still idiots like you willing to subscribe to a completely pointless scam.

Just watch out next time you find your credit card being abused by someone, I hope you then realize how that number got out.

God gives bread to the people with no teeth !
July 3, 2004 6:41 AM
 

Don said:

This is really fun -- it's like Whack-a-Moron.

I know, intellectually, that not all Linux enthusiasts are assholes who need to get laid, but it's so hard... maybe I should paste it above my monitor.
July 8, 2004 12:02 AM
 

Peter said:

"Everything that I read on Newsforge and Slashdot show Java ahead of the race here. As I said, show me a serious development house that uses .NET,..."

Answer = Avanade. 2000+ .Net dvelopers worldwide and growing.
July 12, 2004 2:07 PM
 

Anonymous said:

October 10, 2004 10:57 PM
 

Anonymous said:

October 10, 2004 10:57 PM
 

Mujahid Nawaz said:

Linux is good to work only from the command line
September 14, 2005 4:39 PM
 

None said:

Linux is the suck. .Net is crap too. Seriously now, find me a web site that runs faster or better because its .Net instead of some other language. And I know nothing of .Net and I can still state this as a fact, and you know I'm right. Linux is actually probably not garbage, but it needs so much god damn work to be worth a shit, fuck it, wait till its done. And again, I say all this with no knowledge of Linux, and we all know deep down I'm right. The only valid reason to use Linux is for server hosting companies to avoid buying alot of microsoft licenses.

I left alot of openings in here for the standard forum responses and I would be very dissapointed If they weren't taken advantage of. Don't forget to find something mis-speeled or improper grammar and punctuation use too.
March 24, 2006 12:48 PM
 

khgjhegr said:

Meh.
July 6, 2006 6:56 PM
 

majutsu said:

Hey it's 2006, two years later and microsoft is not only still here, it's ubiquitous. I wonder if Chris A. will come back to admit he was wrong?
July 29, 2006 3:26 AM
 

TrackBack said:

Companies Like Microsoft
March 16, 2004 3:54 AM
 

TrackBack said:

Take Outs for 15 March 2004
March 16, 2004 4:29 AM
 

TrackBack said:

From Geeks to Dragons: Oh, man... Did You See What GAWWWD Did to Us?!?
March 16, 2004 2:54 PM
 

TrackBack said:

From Geeks to Dragons: Oh, man... Did You See What GAWWWD Did to Us?!?
March 16, 2004 8:43 PM
 

TrackBack said:

Rory goes nuts...playing with the mad folks...
March 17, 2004 2:58 PM
 

TrackBack said:

I've been foolish
March 17, 2004 4:28 PM
 

Archis Gore said:

Microsoft is still here. Where's Chris?

Man, that guy was one hell of an entertainment.
September 20, 2006 2:28 AM
 

khgjhegr said:

It's 2007 now. Hee hee.
February 12, 2007 11:29 PM
New Comments to this post are disabled

About Rory

I *own* this site, you loser.

This Blog

Post Calendar

<March 2004>
SuMoTuWeThFrSa
29123456
78910111213
14151617181920
21222324252627
28293031123
45678910

Post Categories

Feeds
Copyright Rory, 2007. All rights reserved.